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 Post subject: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Thu 04 Mar 2010 05:03 PM 
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Virtuoso
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This is a continuation of a listing I originally made in the eBay forum. (I decided to grab it myself :wink:)
See the background discussion and seller's pix here: http://www.matsumoku.org/ggboard/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=6049&start=0

I'll be picking her up on Tuesday. 5 more sleeps :snooze:
Meantime I'd appreciate input on the bridge restoration. SloHand, you there?

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Thu 04 Mar 2010 05:26 PM 
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John, that trem unit on the UK eBay has 2 holes which appear suspiciously in the same place as those in the picture! What up wid dat?

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Thu 04 Mar 2010 06:40 PM 
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Well, the Bendmasters were all 2 holers, and AFAIK, so are the FR's so maybe there was one of those in there at some stage? It's certainly not terminal, eh; I'm certainly suitably envious - I'd love an Urchin, especially at that price!! :)

Go, you good thing!! :up:

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Thu 04 Mar 2010 07:42 PM 
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I guess I shouldn't get into a lather until I actually see the thing, but all the pix I can find of the U60T show a standard 6-screw Strat type bridge. So I'm still puzzled over those holes. :huh: :dunno:

Really don't give a poop one way or t'other, I'll even nail the sucker down and forget about the trem altogether if need be. As long as she looks good and plays right in the end! :freaksmile:

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 04:22 AM 
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Hey Barry.

I'm finally checking back in. I'd been sick[er than usual] for about a week.

EBAY GRIPE ALERT: :x

I never look at the eBay threads, as I've had some serious disputes with them & a few disreputable sellers, & eBay seems to protect sellers (especially high volume sellers) a WHOLE lot better than they do buyers. They were no help to me AT ALL on 1 downright fraud dispute, 2 SNAD (significantly not as described) disputes, & 2 libelous feedback comments posted by one of those sellers. While I still have my eBay I.D., I quit buying from eBay more than 2 years ago after they refused to remove those false feedback comments, & I won't use them until they're gone. Caveat Emptor to the max.

THAT SAID:

First, I really like those knurled speed knobs. My U 70 has smooth [gold] knobs--nowhere near as cool as the knurled ones.

How can I help?

Those pics are scary looking to me. I hope I'm wrong, but it looks like it was drilled for a Floyd before whoever modified it realized he'd have to rout out the trem cavity to get more relief for the Floyd.

Then it looks like he put on a Str@ trem (without considering the string spacing), & "U"s aren't spaced that wide. That would have resulted in wood tear-out because the Str@ trem screws wouldn't have lined up with the U trem screws, & the screws would eat into the wood between the original U trem holes & not hold very well.

I can't tell if that light area is from putty or filler (to give the trem screw threads something to grab onto--which probably also explains the mix & match screws)--or if maybe the paint just peeled down to the primer.

I expect you're going to have a hard-tail project, unless you want to undertake major surgery--& even then, I'd still consider turning it into a hard-tail (with maybe a new coat of paint).

I don't know what you have in mind, but if I were working on this one (& the trem screw area is indeed shot), I'd look around in rummage shops for a cool-looking (& cheap) piece of metalwork (or cut my own) big enough to cover the trem area & work with that to maybe do a variation of the tailpiece like the one on the Paul Stanley model Washburn--maybe not (maybe something with a Billy Gibbons kind of vibe). The extra mass would help sustain, & a big enough piece of metal would reach to good wood for better resonance.

Let me know what direction you want to go in & how involved a project you want to undertake--I have all kinds of crazy ideas. :loon:


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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 10:28 AM 
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slo-hand wrote:
...I'd been sick[er than usual] for about a week.
Hope you're feeling better now. :up:

Quote:
Those pics are scary looking to me. I hope I'm wrong, but it looks like it was drilled for a Floyd before whoever modified it realized he'd have to rout out the trem cavity to get more relief for the Floyd.

Then it looks like he put on a Str@ trem (without considering the string spacing), & "U"s aren't spaced that wide. That would have resulted in wood tear-out because the Str@ trem screws wouldn't have lined up with the U trem screws, & the screws would eat into the wood between the original U trem holes & not hold very well.
Yeah, you're thinking along the same lines as me, and I previously referenced the string spacing issue. But it's all speculation until I get a proper look at it. Somehow, I don't expect we'll be too surprised!

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I expect you're going to have a hard-tail project, unless you want to undertake major surgery--& even then, I'd still consider turning it into a hard-tail (with maybe a new coat of paint).
I'm leaning that way too. I'm not a big whammy player anyway, so simpler is better as far as I'm concerned, plus I don't have the tools to do any serious precision wood working. With luck I can find a bridge that utilizes the old post hole centres to help cover up the mess underneath. In that same vein, if I can still utilize a sustain block for a string-through with a stop bridge I may be able to get the benefit of both.

AND I really don't want to repaint! This looks to be a hard to find Pearl White finish which I'd like to maintain. Again, though, a lot depends on the overall condition.

Thanks Slo...no doubt we'll have a few more discussions over this one! :P

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 11:00 AM 
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If the old bridge mounting holes are in the right position but are a bit chewed up it is not that hard to fix and does not require heavy duty tools. If the holes are just a bit loose, you can use CA glue (e.g. super glue in the US) and a bit of baking soda to create a thicker side wall. Holding the guitarslightly more angled than you would to play when sitting, put a small amount of baking soda in the hole. Drop some CA in. Keep your eyes and nose clear as it can puff up a bit of fumes that are nasty. Change the angle and repeat until you have a snug hole.

If the wood is too chewed up for this it is more involved but not bad if you have a hand drill and a saw. Measure the diameter of the post screw or bushing (if the bridge uses one). Add an 1/8" to that size and buy a hardwood dowel that is at least that size. Measure the depth of the hole and also add 1/8". Using a depth stop drill out the hole using a bit the same diameter as the dowel. The natural shake of a hand drill will likely make a slightly larger hole. If you are using a drill press you will have to go with a slightly bigger drill bit. Push the doewel into the hole all the way and mark where it meet the surface. Cut the dowel about 1/16" shorter than your mark (to leave rooom for the glue). Use wood glue and glue in the dowel. let the glue set for a tleast 24 hours, longer if it cold or damp.

To redrill the hole, mark the center of the dowel and use an awl, center punch nail, etc. to form an indentation at the center. This stops your drill bit from wondering off center. Use a small bit to drill a pilot (also using a depth stop). Then carfully drill the hole for the post using the appropraite drill size with a stop. If you screw one up, you can always drill out the dowel and try again.


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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 12:39 PM 
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Thanks for that RSB. :)
I'm familiar with the techniques you describe..."familiar", but with no first hand experience actually doing it! Two different things to be sure.
But I've survived worse and I'm not shy about having a go at something new.
Let's hope I'm not into major surgery. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 06:23 PM 
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Great info, there, guys - what a mine of techniques and data this site is!! So thanks!! :up:

The only problem I can see with dowelling is that the bridge screws in the end will be going into endgrain rather than sidegrain, and in woodworking class - many years ago!! - I was taught to avoid doing that because it's not as reliable under undue strain. Of course, I may completely wrong... and it wouldn't be the first time that's happened!!

I still reckon it's a go-er, though, Barry unless the wood under that bridge is completely munted..... even then...!!! :D :up:

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 Post subject: Re: Urchin U60T
PostPosted: Fri 05 Mar 2010 07:47 PM 
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Corsair wrote:
...I was taught to avoid doing that because it's not as reliable under undue strain...
Yeah, me too. It's counter intuitive, eh? Still if it's a small area, glued and contained, I presume the co-efficient of friction is increased and the screw threads are nice and snug; no place for the wood fibres to shred away.
Quote:
I still reckon it's a go-er
I hope so. If everything else is good, I can focus on just this one problem area.
And ya know...this will be my first Aria Pro II!

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